Vishwa Hindu Parishad (VHP) leader Suresh Jain talks to Aditi Phadnis about the Ram Mandir issue, migration from Kairana over alleged communal tension and why the introduction of Islamic banking will not be tolerated, even though the prime minister has supported it in Gujarat.
The VHP has just completed its conference in Patna. Tell us what you discussed.
Among other things, we have launched a programme called Hindu Mitra Parivar. We believe that in every village, areas that are to be shared are the village well where people draw drinking water, the shamshan ghat (cremation ground) and other places. We are urging every savarna (caste) Hindu family to adopt one Dalit family and establish the same ties with that family as they would with their own kin and friends. Social harmony will not come about through speeches or dining with other castes; it can increase with this kind of interaction. This has been our experience in many places.
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In the course of your outreach will you address the issue of construction of Ram Mandir? Is that a promise?
On the issue of Ram Mandir, the VHP's position is absolutely clear and it was reiterated at the Patna meeting. Our experience tells us that Ram Mandir cannot be built on the basis of dialogue. How much time the judiciary will take to reach its decision on the matter, nobody can say. Besides, on the issue of Shah Bano, although the judiciary gave one verdict, Parliament intervened and reached its own conclusion. Ultimately if it has to go to Parliament, then it must decide and make up its mind what it wants. It should not make everyone wait any more. So we believe there should be a law brought in Parliament, a joint session should be called, and the building of a Ram temple should be expedited via the passage of a law. This is the only way forward that we can see.
The purpose of meeting MPs is to acquaint them with our work. But on this issue, we have reached out to them in the past and will continue meeting them, especially if they raise the issue.
But the issue of Ram Mandir can be passed in Parliament only if all parties support it….
I believe a majority is enough to pass laws. But if you examine the issue closely, is the Congress not committed to building the Ram Temple? Did Rajiv Gandhi not say, "it is my dream to bring about Ram Rajya"?
Ram Rajya is a generic….
(Interrupts) Can there be Ram Rajya without Ram Mandir? And the most significant thing is where was the movement launched? From Ayodhya! So it is my appeal to the Congress also, especially Soniaji and Rahulji (Congress President and Vice-President Sonia Gandhi and Rahul Gandhi) that they should realise the dream of Rajivji. This argument will then end. You charge the Bharatiya Janata Party (BJP) with making political capital out of Ram Mandir. Bring a resolution. We will tell BJP leaders to support it. A structure that is built with everybody's support will not just be a Ram Mandir; it will be a Rashtra Mandir (temple of the nation). It will establish a new harmony and brotherhood in society. It is the responsibility of all political groups (to do this).
Are you setting a time limit for this? Before the Uttar Pradesh elections, for example?
We have not set a time limit. This is our demand and we hope they will heed our demand.
You are asking for a joint session and saying that it (whether feasible or not) will ensure a majority for this proposal. But the government has now been in power for two years. From the government we normally hear two things: that the matter is in court and that it is in its manifesto. Are you satisfied with this explanation?
In these two years, you, too, would have seen the way Narendra Modi works. He has the capacity to surprise. We have faith that he will take a decision on this matter sooner than later.
Besides, as far as the judiciary is concerned, on the issue of the collegium for the appointment of judges in the Supreme Court, the matter was being heard in the Supreme Court but the law was changed before that. We have the precedents. They can make the law. We see no reason to prevent a law simply because the matter is sub judice.
The charge is that when the BJP is in the Opposition it raises the issue of Ram Mandir, but drops it the minute it comes to power.
I believe leaders of the BJP are committed to the issue of Ram Mandir.
The VHP has taken up the issue of Kairana in a big way. Whether it is the UP government or the central government, the stand of both of them is that there is no communal issue there; families have left Kairana because of economic reasons.
That is why we have asked for a judicial inquiry.
But you have already announced that people are leaving the region on account of communal persecution. So doesn't an inquiry become irrelevant?
Please go there and see for yourself. You will understand the circumstances there - why people are leaving. And not only families there… why are groups of Kavadia pilgrims being attacked? Was there any economic reason behind that? Why has former governor T V Rajeswar said there is a mini Pakistan in the making there?
Anyone who is denying this is merely ignoring the reality there. If you meet people selectively, like maulvis (clerics) and others, you will not understand what is really happening there. Pushing things under the carpet will not suppress the pain and difficulty of the people who have been forced to leave the area.
The district magistrate (DM) there does not belong to any political party. Even he has said there is no migration. Whoever left the area left 50 years ago or 30 years ago….
Although the DM is not part of any party, at whose instance he speaks, we all know perfectly. That is why we want a judicial inquiry.
Didn't a group of Hindu religious leaders visit Kairana and submit its report to the government? In that there was no mention of migration for communal reasons… After that they got threatening telephone calls from the Rashtriya Swayamsevak Sangh and VHP members….
I have also read those statements in the newspapers. I don't think they mentioned any organisation. They said some people had called them. So please don't add names of organisations to their statement. The Hindu religious leader, who was leading them, has also contested an election on a Congress ticket.
The government is planning to start Islamic banking in India. What is your view on this?
In the past there have been efforts to start Islamic banking in India. They had thought of starting it in Kerala. The high court in Kerala had put restrictions on the launch of Islamic banks, after which the proposal was put aside. Islamic banks are against the rules of the Reserve Bank of India and the functions of a bank described in the Banking Regulation Act. Both laws will have to be changed if Islamic banking is to be permitted.
Second, all over the world wherever there are Islamic banks, they are connected, one way or another, with terrorism financing. I don't think it would be in the interest of the nation to open Islamic banks.
But the prime minister has backed the suggestion wholeheartedly in Gujarat….
We have nothing to do with the prime minister's endorsement. The Vishwa Hindu Parishad opposes Islamic banks.
