Full marks to Upa govt on dalit upgrade

Q&A: Ram Vilas Paswan

How many marks do you give to this government out of ten for the implementation of programmes for Dalits ?

I would give it ten out of ten. All governments have to run on the basis of rules and regulations. This is a coalition government. All interests have to be kept in mind. What we have to assess is the government's integrity on its intentions. On SC, ST and OBCs, the government has shown that its intentions are honourable. It wants reservation in the private sector but this is strongly being opposed by business houses. In the situation arising out of judgements of the Supreme Court, you have to take a step-by-step approach. On reservation in private unaided institutions, the Supreme Court has a view but the government has decided to change the Constitution. On reservations for OBCs, despite hard steps detailed by the Supreme Court, the government has decided to retain facilities for the creamy layer.

Every sociologist in the country has opposed the creamy layer decision because it means the dominant castes will hog for perpetuity, the gains of reservations.

Where there is no milk, how can there be cream? If reserved quotas in jobs are filled then maybe I can say, all right, the second generation doesn't need the protection of reservation. But, when job quotas meant for Dalits are going abegging, you need reservation.

Then, take reservation in education. If we had equal educational opportunities in our country, you would not need reservation for the creamy layer. Had education and upkeep of children been free till matriculation, caste would have had no recognition at all.

But here there is dispartiy from childhood. Scheduled Castes and OBCs find it hard to compete without resources. If reservation quotas were filled in Ramvilas Paswan's generation, his son would not have required it.

If any section of society feels insecure, it is bad for the country.

Here you are, awarding high marks to the government on its commitments to Scheduled Castes. But for the Dalits in Khairlanji, this can only seem like a bad joke.

You are talking about individual incidents. I am talking about an overall commitment. In the six-year regime of the National Democratic Alliance (NDA), weaker sections, minorities, labourers... all classes felt insecure, especially after the Gujarat riots. This government has set up the Sachar Committee, we are not talking about unbridled privatisation and loss of jobs....

It is to conceptualise the experience of being a minority that I have arranged an international conference on 27 and 28 December in Delhi. More than 100 people from 90 countries are coming for the conference on Dalits and minorities. People are coming from the US, UK, Japan, Pakistan, Canada....

It sounds more like a project to further Ramvilas Paswan's ambitions than a conference about Dalits and minorities.

Please. I am a Socialist, influenced by Ambedkar and Lohia. When I first became a minister in VP Singh's government, I worked for the welfare of all. I got a picture of Ambedkar installed in Parliament, got the government to give him a Bharat Ratna and ensured neo-Buddhists also got access to the benefits of reservations. I was living in 12 Rajendra Prasad Road around the time Indira Gandhi was assassinated. Because we gave shelter to Sikhs who were being hunted down, my house was burnt down and one Sikh even died. I took to the streets when the Babri Masjid was demolished and I was arrested when the Gujarat riots happened. I resigned from the NDA government. I decided not to help form the government in Bihar when my demand that a Muslim be made CM was not accepted by the others. So I don't think you can question my commitment to Dalits and minorities.

There are people coming from all over the world. Meira Kumar, Mahavir Prasad and other Dalit leaders are also attending the conference to be inaugurated by the prime minister. Arjun Singh will also attend the conference. Would I have called all these people had it been a Ram Vilas Paswan project?

You thought nothing of joining the NDA government...

(interrupts) You should ask me what my mission is: Why should the desecration of a statue in Kanpur lead to caste violence in distant Maharashtra ? I consider myself the radicalising influencing on this government. The prime minister was absolutely right when he said the minorities had the first claim on resources. I don't think he needed to clarify.

The Dalits, minorities and socially oppressed classes have a relationship of pain with the establishment. They consider the system is weighted against them. Until other castes and religions understand their pain and begin talking about their problems, there can be no unity in our society. Oppressed classes form 40 per cent of our society. They have to be made to feel secure.

Can we talk about your ministries? The impression is that when you feel the drug manufacturers are not paying attention to you, you begin threatening them with a drug policy which, it seems, is never going to come...That way you can manipulate the industry...

Not at all. I had a meeting earlier this week and I have finalised the drug policy which will come before Cabinet before 31 December

What are the elements of the new policy ?

I can't really discuss it in detail but given the background of the Supreme Court's orders, 354 bulk drugs will be on the control list of the government. Below Poverty Line (BPL) families will be brought under a health insurance scheme that will cost Rs 3,000 crore per annum. A drug bank will be established in every district that will be funded by the state and central government (earlier drug manufacturers were also to fund it but they want to get out of it now). There will be a cancer assistance fund where the poor will get free cancer medicines and the those above the poverty line will get them at 50 per cent of the cost. There will be several public health initiatives.

What about steel?

I continue to believe that before thinking about exporting iron ore, we must satisfy domentic requirements for high quality ore. I am working on a Mineral Policy that should be ready by mid January, 2007.